Meet longtime CLO Advisory Board member Diana Thomas, executive coach and advisor for Winning Results LLC.
by Elizabeth Loutfi
Chief Learning Officer recently sat down with longtime CLO Advisory Board member Diana Thomas, executive coach and advisor for Winning Results LLC. Thomas previously served as vice president of training, learning and development for McDonald’s USA, and dean of Hamburger University. In 2014, she received CLO’s Norman B. Kamikow Learning Leadership Award.
Chief Learning Officer: Where is your hometown?
I grew up in the Jessup area of Maryland, so I’ve always been maybe an east coast girl. Now, my homebase is in Naples, Florida. I just moved down the coast, as the weather got a little bit warmer, spent 15 years in Chicago and the Midwest, and traveled places. But I think I’ve always been connected to the East Coast and I love water as an Aquarius.
CLO: How did you first become interested in learning and development?
I always wanted to be a teacher, ever since I was five years old. My mom would say, “That’s what all your friends and my sisters and you [did]. You would play school.” My undergraduate was in education, and what I wanted most was to teach third grade. But when I was moving into my senior year of college, the outlook for teachers was not very good. And I was already working for McDonald’s Corporation — I started at McDonald’s when I was 16, and I was already a manager leading a team of individuals. As I started to explore opportunities, leaving McDonald’s and going to be a teacher was going to be really hard. The job market was very soft and pay was very low, which still makes me sad because I think we need to pay teachers a lot more than we do. So, I started to look into human resources and human resources development. When something came open in learning and development, I jumped at it. I get to do what I’ve always wanted to do: train and to teach people, just at a different scale. I think it was in my passion. I love coaching; I love seeing people grow. I love when people are curious and you can feed them resources that they absorb and use and apply.
CLO: What lessons did you learn through out the pandemic that you have taken forward?
I think there’s a lot of lessons. I have learned to do more through virtual, being more remote. Most of my clients, I don’t see face-to-face on a regular basis. It was more through Zoom, so that wasn’t as big of a jump. There’s probably two things that I learned the most, first is just how important having a good relationship with a person is, and connecting to them personally. People today are craving that. They’re so used to it. I jump on a Zoom meeting or Microsoft Teams, but I don’t really know the people that I’m interacting with. It really forced me to coach my leaders to connect better with their employees, especially newer employees. If you already had a relationship with employees, and then you went virtual, it’s different, but now companies are hiring people and you have to build this rapport. I think it’s really critical to get to know the person and connect to the person and have empathy for what everybody is going through.
The other thing is making time to stay healthy. I’ve been on Zoom meetings for 12 to 14 hours, and I haven’t really gotten up and walked around, or there’s comfort food here, I’m eating that instead of making healthier choices. Take some time so your body can recover and get away from work. Initially [during the pandemic], what I saw was people having a little bit more work-life balance because they weren’t driving to work and driving home. But now, that time has been filled with work stuff. You’ve got to put fuel in your tank or you’re not going to have the energy and stamina to give to others.
CLO: As an executive coach, can you share what’s been top of mind for learning and development leaders this past year?
Initially, it was transforming everything digitally. If you weren’t delivering virtually and having people set up to work virtually, there was this scrambled to do that. Now, for the most part, companies have the right technology in place, but they’re still struggling with how to use that technology to best connect to people. I think there’s still more training that has to happen with leaders on how to engage teams, on how to deliver the training and really keep people engaged, and how to really meet our learners where they are. People are getting so saturated. I just saw a report that said the number one thing that could be stressing people out is too much technology. There’s too many Zoom meetings, but people are really craving that personal connection.
The second thing is just health and well-being, not only for themselves as L&D leaders or talent leaders or executives, but how can they help be a good role model and support their employees in health and wellness. Employees are feeling a little scared. [They] want to know that they are going to be supported and groomed for growth opportunities. And if companies aren’t helping their employees feel like that, they’re going to lose them.
Thomas was profiled in the October 2005 issue of Chief Learning Officer.
CLO: How do you enjoy spending your time outside of work?
I love to focus on being healthy, so whenever I can be outside, I love to walk, I love to ride my bike. I’m a big supporter of yoga, both as a student and teaching. I love to read, and it’s been really nice to just read a variety of things. I’m doing some things that I never thought I would do, like doing puzzles with my husband. I’ve never been one that can sit still. My daughter said, “Mom, it’s like meditation. It took you a while to get good at that.” Usually it’s like, what’s the point? You’re just going to put it together and then take it apart. But it’s been fun to engage with the people who live with me to do some puzzles. Anything that just puts you in a different place and helps you feel comfortable, relax and let your body recover, so when you go back [to work], your mind is sharp and you have the ability to sit there for a two- or three-hour Zoom meeting, because you’re not aching. Your body is stronger. Our body has a wonderful ability to heal itself if we allow it.
CLO: What book, either audio or physical, or podcast has gotten you through the pandemic?
I started the pandemic just starting to read about setting goals for this next chapter of my life. So I read “Halftime” by Bob Buford. It really starts to help you think about what you want to do in the second half of your life. And then also this one by David Brooks, “The Second Mountain.” Your first mountain is to raise your family. You have whatever career you’ve started out with, and then at times, you can retire, you can lose your job, you can decide to change. What do you want to do with that second one? I started the year reading those, then, as I started coaching people and seeing that health and wellness was more of an area, I started to follow the podcast and read the book from Jay Shetty, “Think Like a Monk.” I love his simplicity of what he talks about, and he’s very relatable. That’s what I liked. He’s a former monk. Now he’s like a motivational speaker, sharing this concept of four daily practices. He says, “It’s Time.” It’s a powerful way for us to change our mindset so that we can find more peace to enjoy in our own life. He talks about the T, every day is to find something, be thankful for. The I is inspiration, and as a huge learner, we got to keep learning every day. The M is meditation. And this, for me, has been a challenge. I can’t sit there for 30 minutes and just go inward, which — those people who can, even for five, 10 minutes — calms your body. The E is exercising. Every day I usually walk, I do yoga. I like his simplicity of how we can do things in today’s world without setting a hundred goals.
CLO: In your opinion, what are some components of a robust L&D program?
I believe you need to stay customer- and employee-centric. We’ve said that for years, but our customers are changing and our learners are changing. In years past, we developed these big, elaborate learning programs, we hired people that were really good at it and we expected everybody to go through the training, but that doesn’t work in today’s world. When I want to learn something, I don’t want to take an e-learning class, I just want to Google and find the answer. What’s the fastest way? Who’s done it? What’s the best practice? Who’s somebody I can talk to? For learning and development programs to be as successful, they need to really make sure that they’re staying focused on what the learner wants. It could be curating something that’s already made, or it could just be connecting people to an outside resource, one that the company hasn’t created, because it’s the most effective. When employees have feedback for us, or something’s not working, we’re asking and we’re listening and making changes, so [we] continue to be agile. We are, now, managers and leaders in constant change. That takes endurance. That takes flexibility. That takes about setting expectations to meet current reality and meeting people where they are.
CLO: What advice do you have for CLOs and learning leaders?
You got to take care of yourself. You’ve got to have the energy to show up and really be able to perform. Make sure you’re connecting to your purpose that guides you. So many people came into this field because they love to connect with people and help them grow, so make sure that you have a good vision for yourself, that your team has a good vision, so that you can inspire yourself and others to continue to perform and do what brings you joy and gets you jazzed up. And if you’re not enjoying what you’re doing, then you need to either go back and reset your mindset, or you need to change. We’ve found that life is too short. So I always start with that. I’m coaching people to do what their innate purpose is, what brings them that happiness and joy and do it at the highest level. Take care of yourself and take care of those around you.